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Politics
Politics of Energy
An SI Board Since May 2007
Posts SubjectMarks Bans
83351 157 9
Emcee:  Brumar89 Type:  Moderated
This board is a place to discuss the interaction between political influences and energy supply and potential future development. Because climate issues affect the politics of energy that is on topic here. There are other places to talk about specific investment ideas, like Big Dogs BBR but if you want to discuss such things here feel free.

I do realize that political issues can raise passion levels, but let's try to hold down back and forth name calling and personal insults. We don't want to ruin the board for other posters and readers.

Official Thread Sound Track is hereby declared to be "Drill Baby Drill"
Message 31234198

Runner Up: Where Have All The Eagles Gone?
youtube.com
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Charles Manson, Global Warming Prophet 57585
Hansen - last interglacial warmer 69530
Alarmists spurn solar 70609
NASA adj 71558
No US warming for past century 57234, 76707
The Most Comprehensive Assault On 'Global Warming' Ever 73303
Climate Movement International Governance 73814
How to tell who is lying to you 73939
Human Attribution Science and Hype 74143
NASA data tampering in the cause of model driven science demonstrated 74294
NOAA highlevel fraud exposed by expert insider 74663
Study refutes warming 74723
Dr Neil Frank, PhD on climate change 74788
How GHCN software changed Maine, Mich, CA temp record 74782
Solar's NF3 17,200 X the GHG CO2 is 75149
Nearly half of GHCN stations at airports as of 2009 74871
11 US energy maps 75152
Facts about world oil demand 75193
German physicist on impracticality of EV's 75672
Agriculture and CO2 75697
Facts on Holocene Ice Fluctations 75984
Nice Lindzen discussion 76559
The digital revolution impact on energy 76592
O&G vs solar and wind 76793
Singer on temp trends 76836
NASA modeling expert says climate models can't predict climate 76933
Cliff Mass, Criminal Climate Change Denialist 76928
What it would take for GHG's to warm the ocean 77060
What IS the avg temp of the earth? 77514 & 77572 There has been essentially no global warming for a century + ... what's claimed as warming is just the adjustment downward of past recorded temperatures.
PNAS: 100% renewables delusional 77669
Cowboyistan still in charge 77670
Toxic solar pv waste a major growing problem 77813
Earth nearly doomed by low CO2 during last ice age 77896
$5+ TRILLION to wind energy companies 77898
Solar panels composed partially of fossil fuels 77930
Wind power requires 100% backup by conventional energy 78059
Droughts becoming more severe? No, says science 78060-78064
Science determined by the funding 78349
Diminishing effect of increasing CO2 on temperature 78358
Child miners aged four living a hell on Earth so YOU can drive an electric car 78774
Federal climate report thoroughly debunked 78787
3 good points re CAGW: 78797&78798
Why there can never be a renewable powered aluminum smelter 78799
Noble cause Chicken Littles should not be believed 78916
Former GISS & Potsdam climate scientists call for GISS to be defunded 78959-78962
Climate scientists: Warming has been over-estimated 78989-78990
Excellent statistical analysis of temp data - even after dubious adj's temp record indistinguishable from a random walk 79082
Lesson of LTCM 79083
No LT trend toward extreme weather 79136
10 reasons why new technologies will cause future energy use to SKYROCKET 79236
Freeman Dyson carbon and topsoil formation 79398
79465 Pielke: weather extremes claims in absence of evidence
79513 NYT: solar & wind don't lower CO2 emissions
Will Happer 79525
Rare earths highly concentrated in US coal basins 79537
Chinese EV's produce more CO2 than ICE's; 1600 coal plants planned or being built, 43% expansion in coal capacity 79612, 79684
Cliff Maas on CA fires 79682
20 posts in which climate alarmists admit their goal is poverty for humanity and that they lie shamefacedly in pursuit of that goal: Posts 79714 - 79733 on the Politics of Energy thread
How US Temp Record Has Been Changed 79931
Burning wood = 4X CO2/MWh as natural gas; 50% more than coal 79963
Another demonstration of cooling the past, Ithaca 79976
Nazi & other strange roots of climate catastrophism 80013, 80014
Adam Smith proven right again 80033
Problems w/global temp records 80142, 80143, 80145
Lithium from TX ng wells 80148
1,407 temperature stations from across the contiguous U.S. do not show any warming trend during 1901 to 2015. 80153
US blizzards increasing 80158
Cities, counties screw themselves over climate change lawsuits 80171
NASA says water vapor not increasing, no "hot spot" as predicted. Climate models suck. 80175
CO2 endangerment finding must be reopened. 80176
Cube development next big thing in shale drilling? 80204
ExxonKnew postmortem 80370
How could XOM/Shell keep global warming a secret if Tyndale & Arrhenius wrote about it in the 1800's? 80462
Heh, Going off fossil fuels 80536
Windmills, not fracing, a threat to water wells 80687-80699
UN report on fracking 80793
Liberal green ideas counter-productive - 80979 (anti-nuclear, windpower) 80981, 80993 (recycling is BAD)
Florida to be gone in 77 years 80982
India plans to stripmine moon for nuclear plant fuel 80984
Hansen: Renewables and batteries a grotesque idea! 80991
US per capita carbon emissions lowest since 1950 81049
Natl Hurricane Center - NO Trend in Florida hurricane strikes 81283
Cobalt & lithium envionmental destruction 81294
Getting snowier and winters colder 81371
Mass: Global warming not to blame for CA fires 81379, 81384
Palm oil environmental destruction in the name of greenness 81389
Greenland long term temp perspective 81419
SO2 & NOx emissions down dramatically over 20 yrs 81476
Social benefit = $4,380 per tonne of CO2 81484
Wind energy intemittancy charted 81539
Wind energy really sucks 81560
Bio-mass, hydroelectric, waste to energy is NOT renewable greens 81568
Failed predictions 81579
Sahara shrinking 81580
Environmentalist Fanatics as Super Villains: 81585
Holocene warm periods 81611
Polar vortex goes back to 1853 81660
Snowdon Wales another failed prediction 81663
3 mos ago, NOAA predicted normal winter 81664
KILLER TOAST! 81734. 81735
Roast dinner danger 81739
The dark side of green technology 81749 Cobalt-Lithium mining hellscapes
US leads world in CO2 emission reductions 81825
Senate rejects Green New Deal without a single vote in its favor 81901
Unpopularity of Green New Deal 81948
Arctic warmer 4000 years ago 81956
Inconvenient tree stumps in Arctic 81963
America: The Leader in Clean Air 82004
China building 300 coal plants around the world 82031
US leads in air pollution reduction due to increased natural gas use 82067
Permanent drought - yet another climate prediction failure 82117
US crude oil and natural gas exports 82202
Ocean fertilization is ongoing 82239
US natural gas cuts carbon emissions sharply 82271, 82274
US CO2 emissions lowest wind since 1985 82405
1877-1878 Global warming before major world industrialization 82409
Wa state rejected carbon tax 82446
Glacial Lake Missoula 82476
SF6 most powerful green house gas 82482
Hydrogen vs Electric 82518
US first major nation to meet Kyoto target 82684
What fracking means for the poor 82717
Anti-Fracking Activist: Vladimir Putin 82725
US becoming top LNG exporter 82737
Tree stumps under glaciers in Iceland, Alaska, Switzerland, Patagonia mean it was WARMER then than now 82767
Chinese coal use rising fast 82786-88
Suing Tesla, Apple over dead child laborers 82794
Fracking ban would kill the geothermal energy industry 82925-82927
Warmist leader embraces nuclear power 83189
Green Activist apologies for climate scares 83194
Matt Ridley 83214
No global warming in over 100 yrs 83254
Wildfire prescription: More cattle and beavers 83282, 83283
Where is NYC's sea level rise? 83319



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Something different - I'm accepting Eric's challenge to pick a fossil fuel stock to compare over the long term (10 yrs) with TSLA. I'll pick XOM v TSLA for 10 yrs. I will treat cash dividends received as a reduction of the basis. This is simpler than having to reduce the share basis for repurchases. XOM is at $72.37 right now, TSLA is at $246.60. Using a 100 share vs 30 share count will closely equalize the investments ... letting TSLA have a slight lead starting off.

As suggested by Eric, I'll modify the challenge as follows today - 9/15/15:

30 shares of TSLA 9/11/15 = $7,398
150 shares of SCTY 9/15/15 = $7,260
310 shares of SPWR 9/15/15 = $7,223
150 shares of FSLR 9/15/15 = $7,005
total for 4 alt energy stocks (w/ beginning value of about $7K ea) you mentioned about a year ago = $28,886

TSLA and SCTY merged in 2016 with each SCTY share being converted into 0.11 share of TSLA. So the original 150 shares of SCTY became 16.5 shares of TSLA bringing the TSLA share total to 46.5 shares. The value of this portfolio at 12/30/17 is $27,219.08, a big recovery from $16,800 at year end 2016. The total decline in value since mid Sept 2015 is -5.8%%.

vs

100 shares of XOM 9/11/15 = $7,237
230 shares of KMI 9/15/15 = $6,923
150 shares of COP 9/15/15 = $7,127
90 shares of PSX 9/15/15 = $7,146
total for 4 traditional energy stocks (w/ beginning value of about $7K ea) I selected = $28,433

Since Sept 2015, these stocks have paid dividends and I'm treating dividends received as a reduction of the basis from $28,433 to $26,409. The value of this portfolio at 12/30/17 is $29,857.10. This is 13.05% greater than the basis after adjustment for dividends received.

27 month comparison: Eric's Alt Energy portfolio -5.8% My Fossil Fuel portfolio +13.05%

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"Remember this was a tiny field, a backwater, and then suddenly you increased the funding to billions and everyone got into it," Lindzen said. "Even in 1990 no one at MIT called themselves a ‘climate scientist,’ and then all of a sudden everyone was. They only entered it because of the bucks; they realized it was a gravy train.






1999 version : 1999_Hansen_etal_1.pdf
2015 version: Fig.D.gif (525×438)
Message 30294738 gif
Message 30705971


Message 30214692











Message 30408321 gif


Message 31493412


U.S. Data Since 1895 Fail To Show Warming Trend – NYTimes.com

Greenland ice cores: post 75984
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ReplyMessage PreviewFromRecsPosted
83351 In Dubai, oil-rich UAE sees a new wonder: A coal power plant https://news.yahooBrumar89-9 hours ago
83350What are farmers doing besides feeding the rest of us? A NASA satellite found soBrumar89-9 hours ago
83349Climate “catastrophe” myths, realities and why you should care Those of us who Brumar89-Saturday
83348 Five Things The President Should Say About Climate Change Many Republicans likBrumar89-Saturday
83347Biden Declares He Would ‘Transition’ America Away from Oil Industry during DebatTimF-last Friday
83346 Natural gas viewed more positively than other fossil fuels across 20 global pubBrumar89-last Friday
83345Grand Solar Minimum at work. Today is warmer as we had a southern wind blowing robert b furman-last Wednesday
83344Minnesota Weather: Record-Setting Snow Storm Drops Several Inches Across State Brumar89-last Wednesday
83343Here in Wisconsin many people in the rural areas utilize a wood boiler for heat robert b furman-last Wednesday
83342Environmental Rape Of Africa: Hamburg Power Plants Aim To Deforest Namibia For PBrumar89-last Wednesday
83341New Study: East Antarctica Was Up To 6°C Warmer Than Today During The MedieBrumar89-October 16
83340Freakonomics Radio - How Efficient Is Energy Efficiency? [youtube video] youtubTimF-October 15
83339India Continues To Bet Big On Coal Despite Renewable Energy Ambitions By VanandBrumar89-October 15
83338Very true.Brumar89-October 14
83337People who push solar and wind tend to point out their cost for X installed capaTimF-October 14
83336 Solar Power Costs 2-3 Times As Much As Wind, Fossil Fuels and Nuclear David MidBrumar89-October 14
83335The High Cost of California Electricity Is Increasing Poverty California’s poveTimF-October 13
83334Washington State blows away wind fantasies Charles Rotter Reposted from CFACT Brumar89-October 13
83333 Unheralded Global Ocean 2000-Year Temperature Reconstruction Reveals EmbarrassiBrumar89-October 13
83332Democrats Must Preserve an 'All-of-the-Above' Energy Strategy By Tom MBrumar89-October 13
83331Google probably has backup power for their data centers and maybe for their offiTimF-October 12
83330Google, Boston Review Promote Rolling Blackouts to Cut CO2 Emissions Among the Brumar89-October 12
83329Geothermal Energy Market Heats Up As Big Oil Moves In By Rystad Energy - Oct 10Brumar89-October 11
83328New York Times Climate Hype Isn’t Helping But Natural Gas Does Posted on OctobeBrumar89-October 8
83327Biden wins over Pennsylvania union leaders worried about his climate plan by JBrumar89-October 8
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