| To: diegosan who wrote (199310) | 6/19/2019 5:08:30 PM | | From: Elroy Jetson | | | | Don't most petrol stations do a side business selling gold coins, Pepsi and Tostitos?
I think it's fair to say they'll sell anything with a large mark-up to supplement the smaller margins on fuel sales. |
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| To: isopatch who wrote (199309) | 6/19/2019 6:16:29 PM | | From: JimisJim | | | | ESV was one of my favorite customers I worked with when I was at VRC/NOV... very good management team and they'd successfully become a legit DGI play for LT investors... and then came 2014/2015. We were just talking about ESV, RIG and even DO (remember them?) over at the divvy investing for retirement board the past week.
Not that it matters (as in just because I'm not familiar with them, they can't be all that good, and I've never heard much about CPE over the years, good or bad... I just rarely crossed paths with them and know less than zero about them.
I'm not sure what to make of SPN... but I plead ignorance when it comes to the onshore E&Ps... I just never spent much time with land operations at all -- maybe 5% of my time annually.
When NOI bought out VRC, a lot of engineers I worked with ended up at PTEN... just going by the experience and brains of the ones who ended up there, I'd have to predict they are quite good at what they do.
Interesting reads and I'm slowly catching up on land operators.
Thx for posting that and contributing to my edu ma cation...
Jim |
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| To: JimisJim who wrote (199312) | 6/19/2019 6:42:18 PM | | From: isopatch | | | | Thanks Jim. Between the two of us, we cover a lot the industry. Never been on an offshore platform. But am very thankful for the guidance, advice and active mentoring from onshore operators, geologists, engineers, and service people at all levels since the mid 1980s.
PTEN the big dawg drilling two nearby horizontal wells, AWA others in WV this Summer. Eye opening, for sure to see who made the cut into their starting lineup of associate and support contractors from all over their nationwide network.
A Superior subsidiary, and Stingray (closely associated with, and often directly supervised by, Baker Hughes managers on location R just 2 of a long list of subcontractor trucks of all sizes roaring by for months. 2nd well pad waiting on available to drill laterals into Marcellus and Utica shales. Til that work is done? Frac crews and equipment were redirected and rigged, up a few days ago, on 3rd PTEN drilled well. It's in Jane Leu, about 45 miles ENE of us Company rep told me that one has SIX laterals.
Two 400-600 acre Antero lease blocks which each include some of my mineral acreage, are about 10 to 14 miles due east. Expire in 11 months. Have no idea how many laterals they're contemplating. Of course, nothing is certain until they get into the formation and see if it's well consolidated or prone to caving.
Iso |
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| To: diegosan who wrote (199310) | 6/19/2019 7:05:30 PM | | From: JimisJim | | | | I inherited a lot of silver and gold eagles of all sizes from 1/10 oz up to 1 full oz -- silver eagles tend to only come in 1 oz size.
You can buy them almost everywhere, including the US Mint (my father subscribed to get 3 of every gold and silver product the mint was selling).
There's a bit of a premium over spot price for U.S. gold and silver eagles because they have U.S. name on them. They are terrible investments for long stretches of time, then they catch fire.
A much better way to go is with the pre-1932 gold coins -- they command large premiums because they have significant numismatic value, whereas the eagles are essentially just bullion with official U.S. govt backing them up. Instead of eagles, one would be better off (better prices, lower premium when buying) just buying rounds or bars of various sizes from one of several major private mints -- per bullion coin premium is lower than eagles and unless your silver eagles grade/slab at least MS-68 or better, they're just pieces of metal and not collectible, nor have much premium attached to them.
The best way to acquire eagles (gold or silver) is to inherit them. Or buy directly from the mint and especially with the silver eagles, get the BU (brilliant uncirculated). They give the most bang for the buck and the metal prices have to really go up before you get any appreciable premium for the silver eagles. The 24K gold buffalo coins are a slightly better value, but forget collecting them like traditional coins -- they scratch just looking at them they are so soft.
I cherry picked BU and proof silver eagles from Dad, one from each mint for 30 some years; all proofs, but when I sent a few to be graded and slabbed the grades were all over the map. A collection like that where they all grade out at 70 (perfect), is worth about $10K, but that same collection averaging grades of 68? worth exactly the same as if you were selling/buying individual coins, a bit above $2,000 I think when I checked a couple or three years ago when I inherited 1/3 of Dad's stash -- and silver was above $16/oz at the time... much lower now.
It got to the point I started selling almost all of the silver coins, period... my most valuable silver coin was a commemorative made by the mint on the 75th anniversary of a Civil War battle and the only coins ever that had both Lee and Grant on them. It was a 1/2 oz 90% silver coin in AU condition making it worth about twice the going spot price for gold, not silver. 98% of commemorative coins never appreciate more than the bullion itself and in fact, some dealers won't touch them because there's no demand -- or as one guy told me, there is demand for a short while for the latest, most recent commems, but the mint makes 2-4 different commems every year. Then the next year, the value of the previous year's commems goes down as does demand for them. Even gold commems are not ideal -- you will get at least spot price on those most of the time.
Apmex (an online buyer and seller of all manner of coins foreign and domestic) is a decent starting point to get a feel for the gold and silver eagles, and they buy and sell other types of coins, too... they are on the up and up for the most part and offer lower premiums for buying in quantity, but not if you sell to them. They also have minimum amounts before they'll even talk to you... as I recall they wouldn't touch any buy or sell for less than $10K for some products and $1k for others. They are a good source of buying actual U.S. pre-1964 silver coins (90% silver), again, mostly because the US brand on coins is worth at least a little premium.
In most cases, when you buy, expect to pay $1-$2 per oz for BU or better silver eagles, but when you sell, you'll only get current spot price. Same issue with gold, but the premiums are larger both buying and selling. I know a retired dealer who explained they have to try to maintain a certain level of stock to sell, but to make a profit, coins like silver commems only bring spot price MINUS a premium to spot regardless of grade/quality.
He also tells me there just isn't much demand for bullion coins any more 10-20 years ago they were sort of a novelty and one could make money buying/selling them... but the last 10 years, there just hasn't been any demand for anything but gold or silver numismatic coins that are worth more to certain types of collectors than plain old eagles.
Maple Leafs are essentially the same as eagles in almost every respect, except (not sure if this is true or not) they sometimes sold 1, 2, 5, 10 oz silver maple leafs which were interesting.
And to top it all off, you gotta store these things -- completely safe storage costs money and slowly drains value from them.
After inheriting all those silver eagles, they came in nice little display boxes and made good gifts to young folk for birthdays and Christmas, but other than that -- I got rid of almost all the silver eagles. I kept the gold eagles because they come in 1/10oz; 1/4oz; 1/2 oz and 1oz and the gold eagles always fare better than the silver. Same situation with Canadian, Mexican, Australian, South African, etc. -- they are all about the same, just come in different sizes/weights.
They do make good/fun stocking stuffers for younger folks, but as an investment? Not so hot unless they have numismatic value, too, which excludes about 98% of the eagles pumped out by the mint. Otherwise you pay (and receive) smaller premiums for true bullion products like rounds or bars of various weights -- and 3 or 4 private mints hold their own price-wise with US eagles or the maple leafs, etc.
The one thing I did like about the 1/10 and 1/4 oz gold eagles is you could turn them into very nice necklaces -- everyone sells little "adaptors" so you can put them on a chain -- but if you do that with say 1/10 oz eagles, the chain -- if it's any good and fairly high purity gold themselves, the chain can be worth more than the coins. But both my wife and my daughter really like their 1/10 oz coins, in pendant adaptors and put on chains of at least 18K gold or better.
FWIW, the US mint also sells platinum and palladium bullion coins as well, but what's the point -- they look exactly like the much much cheaper silver eagles. |
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| To: isopatch who wrote (199313) | 6/19/2019 7:10:09 PM | | From: JimisJim | | | | | If all that heavy (literally heavy as in weighs a lot) truck traffic continues at this pace, W. VA is going to have to have several infrastructure weeks a year to keep the roads good. Asphalt roadways are like glass in that if what's underneath them compacts, creating space between the underlying bed and the asphalt itself, or if it washes out from beneath the asphalt surface, you get pot holes or worse -- imagine that weight driving over a road made out of actual glass and you get the idea. |
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| To: JimisJim who wrote (199315) | 6/19/2019 8:54:47 PM | | From: isopatch | | | | Spot on. In fact, State & County road crews already have the pot holes, including several pretty big ones, filled and rolled. Pretty quiet this week.
Just came in from feeding Margaret the deer in the back yard. Local hardware store stocks feed mixes specifically formulated for Deer, Horses, Cattle, Sheep, etc. People don't want to hunt and eat venison of diseased Deer.
Iso |
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| To: diegosan who wrote (199310) | 6/19/2019 10:27:16 PM | | From: Black Blade | | | | | I currently buy American Silver Eagles locally from a couple dealers near me. If I were to buy a "green monster box" of 500 there are several online dealers. Regardless you always pay a premium over spot when buying and selling PMs. Spot price is just a gauge of where prices are for institutions and retail prices are slightly higher. When factoring shipping and insurance costs it is usually just easier and cost effective to buy from a local dealer. |
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| To: E_K_S who wrote (199317) | 6/19/2019 11:53:37 PM | | From: JimisJim | | | | That was roughly the spot price 3 or 4 yrs ago. I still glance at PM spot prices. Silver is lower now than recent years. In fact what I kept vs sold when my father died is worth less now than when he died.
I’m not a bear in the actual metal, collectibles — I think it’s sideways chop for bullion awhile longer barring a bolt from the blue, but I haven’t done the FA “work” to make such assertions supported by actual analyses.
I will flatly state the spot price is currently about the same as when I inherited my share of the pirates’ treasure, but silver is about a buck per oz lower right now despite gold bullion regaining a bit in spot bullion prices.
These are simple statements that are not subject to interpretation since I experienced it first hand over several months as my brother and I sold most of the bullion and kept/added the good stuff to collect and pass down to our kids.
Numismatic gold coins in particular have outperformed other forms of gold, except maybe (haven’t checked) niches of specific jewelry or other justifiable reasons to fetch higher premiums.
I hope everyone already knows the difference between the various equity market products like miners, but also “paper” gold vs actual claims against actual metal. I think i’ve mentioned before that I liked CEF for the later — the Canadian fund roughly 50:50 gold to silver and that there really is metal stored and allocated based on how much one “invests” in the fund.
I sold my CEF when I got my grubby paws on a lot more numismatics and felt a bit over invested in gold and silver. I don’t expect to make bazillions with gold and silver, but I like what I have whether one calls it an investment, a collection/hobby and have as much as I want. If prices spike a lot some where down the road I’d likely sell more of pure bullion remaining and spend on a few river cruises. Or maybe a Patagonian adventure. |
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