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To: Alastair McIntosh who wrote (12501)1/6/2012 7:04:51 AM
From: brokenst0nes
   of 15256
 
Li-ion batteries are integrated into power grid too, though I'll steer clear of any argument on defining major.

Large scale Li-ion battery costs will drop if/when EV market takes off. Further, many parties are developing Li-ion batteries with different combination of materials, likely improving cell capacities/efficiencies, and cycle rates over time, which will help drive down costs.

Does PbC have similar forces at play?

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From: brokenst0nes1/6/2012 7:08:13 AM
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bloomberg.com

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From: Eric1/6/2012 7:41:43 AM
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Info on German new feed in tariff going forward:

  • EEG 2012 passed
  • After a long debate, the German Government passed the new feed-in tariff rules and regulations for Germany - valid as of 2012.
http://www.solarwirtschaft.de/en/photovoltaic-market/political-framework/

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From: Eric1/6/2012 8:37:37 AM
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Mongolia's Renewables Belittle World's Nuclear Supply

bloomberg.com

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To: brokenst0nes who wrote (12509)1/6/2012 8:39:57 AM
From: Alastair McIntosh
   of 15256
 
Does PbC have similar forces at play?

There is other ongoing research on PbC. However Axion has apparently bulletproof patents on their negative electrodes which are five-layer assemblies that consist of a carbon electrode, a corrosion barrier, a current collector, a second corrosion barrier and a second carbon electrode. These electrode assemblies are then sandwiched together with conventional separators and positive electrodes to make their battery.

Li-ion battery costs and cycle rates have a vey long way to go to match PbC. According to the Sandia report I referenced earlier large Li-ion storage costs $600/KWh for 4000 cycle life compared to a PbC cost of $330/KWh for 20,000 cycle life. However, BMW testing confirmed Axion's PbC battery for 40,000 cycles for a stop-start application. Subsequent testing showed a 100,000 cycle life.

However, until an automaker confirms use of PbC in a stop-start system Axion remains speculative.

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To: brokenst0nes who wrote (12510)1/6/2012 8:43:39 AM
From: Alastair McIntosh
   of 15256
 
Re: Chinese Companies Prefer Dying to Being Bought, JinkoSolar Says

The weakest companies should “weed out” about 75 percent of output capacity so that China has a “reasonable” 20 gigawatts compared with 75 gigawatts estimated by the second quarter of 2013, Zhang Longgen, chief financial officer of the Shanghai-based solar module maker, said in a Jan. 4 telephone interview.

Sounds promising for the survivors, two of which I hope are JKS and YGE.

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To: Alastair McIntosh who wrote (12513)1/6/2012 9:25:22 AM
From: brokenst0nes
   of 15256
 
Ah separators, an interesting area to research and invest in. Plays in most of the different battery technologies.

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To: brokenst0nes who wrote (12515)1/6/2012 11:43:25 AM
From: Alastair McIntosh
   of 15256
 
Axion seems to be getting lots of press lately:

news.cnet.com

New lead-acid battery angles for micro hybrids

Modernizing 150-year-old battery technology may be one of the cheapest routes to hybrid autos.

Axion Power International has a developed an advanced lead-acid battery it hopes will attract automakers and grid storage providers. The basic chemistry and components are the same, but the company has an activated carbon negative electrode, a change that leads to better performance over time, according to the company.

In the auto industry, the company is targeting start-stop hybrids in particular. Also called microhybrids, start-stop systems feature a small battery to run a car's electronics when idle and to aid in accelerating.

Unlike an all-electric car, the fuel efficiency savings from start-stop technology are incremental. Ford, for example, estimates an efficiency gain between 4 and 10 percent for its system. But small lead-carbon batteries are far cheaper than more "exotic" alternatives, such as lithium ion batteries or ultracapacitors, and analysts project millions to be sold in Europe and the U.S. in the coming years, said Axion Power CEO Tom Granville.

"It's neater to write about exotic technologies," he said. "That's revolutionary. We're talking about an evolution. It's a step change, but it doesn't require building new plants."

Automakers are already using lead-acid batteries for start-stop systems. Granville said that Axion Power's electrode will not degrade as quickly when batteries are fully discharged and charged frequently, as a driver would do in stop-and-go traffic. In traditional lead-acid batteries, crystals form over time on the electrode that slow down the charge acceptance, he explained. BMW and Axion Power developed a system to test lead-acid batteries for start-stop that takes into account charging capacity over time, he said.

The company's batteries are also being tested for grid storage applications, where a range of competing technologies, including flow, lithium ion, and sodium sulfur batteries. On Wednesday, the company announced a project where it will store solar power generated electricity at the Washington, D.C., Naval Yard in a net-zero energy building project. In November, its PowerCube grid storage battery was also chosen to provide frequency regulation services in the grid.

One of the advantages of Axion Power's approach is that its technology can be fitted into existing manufacturing lines. "You just put a stack of active carbon instead of lead negative plates as the batteries come out," Granville said.

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From: brokenst0nes1/6/2012 4:04:29 PM
2 Recommendations   of 15256
 
Killer Battery Eludes Electric Car Makers

cnbc.com

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To: brokenst0nes who wrote (12517)1/6/2012 4:07:07 PM
From: brokenst0nes
   of 15256
 
More Hybrid Vehicle Technology on the Way

cnbc.com

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