SI
SI

 Technology Stocks | Advanced Micro Devices - Moderated (AMD)


Previous 10 | Next 10 
To: eracer who wrote (187696)2/18/2006 9:22:57 PM
From: dougSF30 of 272560
 
You know, when I saw Keith post that article featuring big-talkin' Mooly I just knew you'd be all over it over here, with doomsday scenarios.

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read | Read Replies (2)

To: dougSF30 who wrote (187709)2/18/2006 9:41:54 PM
From: eracer of 272560
 
You know, when I saw Keith post that article featuring big-talkin' Mooly I just knew you'd be all over it over here, with doomsday scenarios.

I was just joining in the conversation. If I wanted to make a big deal about it I would have posted it here first attached with my "doomsday scenarios" and gone over to the Ace's and IHub threads and done the same. If I was cheering Intel on I would have gloated about the 20% performance gain as if it had already happened rather than making more general statements about the impact on AMD's ASPs if Intel reaches relative parity with AMD in terms of performance and features.

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read

From: eracer2/19/2006 7:00:58 AM
of 272560
 
The first rev. F samples WERE duds! The result was a delayed rev. F launch according to Charlie.

One thing we recently heard is that there was a fairly nasty bug in the DDR2 controller that made the chips pretty well 'blow' on memory performance... Now, memory performance is said to be much better, basically to not blow...

theinquirer.net 


Hmmm, sounds familiar:

I guess that explains the new stories about Socket AM2 sampling for Cebit, even though it was sampling last year. Looks like at least the first revision is a dud, unless all of the problems are motherboard/chipset/driver related.

Message 22152483

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read | Read Replies (1)

To: Sarmad Y. Hermiz who wrote (187707)2/19/2006 7:17:31 AM
From: niceguy767 of 272560
 
Just a couple of points:

1. If there is such a thing as a slam dunk, AMD's lawsuit is just that from my vantage point. Any settlement in this lawsuit will likely mitigate greatly any Fab 36 costing concerns that any have, assuming, of course, that any such costing concerns are grounds for concern. But in the off chance that a healthy settlement isn't granted by the court, then I'm guessing that, given the marketshare growth phase that AMD has now entered (and for very good reason, being, superior product) the 20% to 25% operating profit will be more than ample to cover off even the most inflated Fab 36 cost estimates that one can conjure up...and then achieve $2.00 eps in 2006, without a 30% marketshare.

2. Intel's monopoly pricing model can only be smashed by either court action or by non-INTC (primarily AMD) marketshare rising to 30% or more. Interestingly, even with the HUGE aid provided to IMTC by their monopoly pricing model, AMD, owing to a superior roadmap, has now entered a phase of increasing MS gains and increasing ASP's. Obviously these opposing forces (INTC monopolistic pricing model and AMD MS and ASP gains) is an unstable phase. Something has to give.

From my vantage point, and a growing body of analysts I see, it is the INTC monopolistic pricing model that is now the more vulnerable and once punctured, could well result in years and years of a much, much weaker INTC, both real and perceived.

Oh, with your outlook, are you long INTC and short AMD at the current price levels, 'cause that's another test as to how firmly you stand behind your current outlook.

(To be fair, I'm not only long AMD, but remain aggressively invested in calls, as my pricing model is looking for key price points of $45, $48.50 and $60 by the end of July as the current AMD momentum builds...and my price model is not predicated on 30% marketshare and does include costing for Fab 36)

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read | Read Replies (2)

From: niceguy7672/19/2006 8:06:09 AM
of 272560
 
Demystification of Pentium M vs. Turion here:

silentpcreview.com 

thanks to saxplayer0001@yahoo.

PS. Seems like Turion can hold its own against Pentium M and at great cost advantage for like performers.

(Bodes well for the next couple of Turion iterations, I'd guess...Lots of MS potential in this 60M unit/annum space for Turion, I'm thinking.)

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read

To: heatsinker2 who wrote (187688)2/19/2006 8:36:59 AM
From: j3pflynn of 272560
 
hs2 - I wonder if Charlie saw numbers from a broken DDR2 controller version of AM2? Nah, seems like he'd have noticed the poor performance.

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read | Read Replies (1)

To: j3pflynn who wrote (187714)2/19/2006 9:01:59 AM
From: eracer of 272560
 
Re: hs2 - I wonder if Charlie saw numbers from a broken DDR2 controller version of AM2? Nah, seems like he'd have noticed the poor performance.

When Charlie wrote his Conroe vs. X2 desktop article a while back with hypothetical performance figures for each he assumed a clock-for-clock performance increase for X2 rev. F of 10% versus Socket-939 X2 due to DDR2 and other tweaks. He would have noticed the poor performance and not used the buggy sample numbers in any comparison.

theinquirer.net 

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read

To: niceguy767 who wrote (187712)2/19/2006 10:26:02 AM
From: Sarmad Y. Hermiz of 272560
 
ng, Thanks for your reply. To answer your last question first, I'm not short AMD, nor do I intend to be. My interest in AMD is to see whether it can continue to take market share from Intel, and whether AMD can maintain lower prices for their chips compared to similar performance Intel products. I'm assuming that is how AMD moved up to the present 20% MS.

>> If there is such a thing as a slam dunk, AMD's lawsuit is just that from my vantage point.

I'll take your word for that. I didn't even know the suit existed until I read it on this board. I think you mean that Intel will be compelled to raise its prices, which will enable AMD to raise its ASP, which will bring in more profits to AMD. Sounds like a duopolist dream come true.

But I want to discuss the boring item of cost. I read here that FAB 30 was fully depreciated, so products from it bring very high margin. I imagine that's how AMD can price its chips below intel's and still have a profit. So I'm trying to figure out if this same level of margin will continue when Fab30's products are transitioned to Fab36.

One puzzling thing in AMD's balance sheet is that, in q4, plant and equipment (PPE) dropped from $4.3B to $2.7B, even though AMD spent several hundred millions on fab 36. I know that AMD transferred assets to Spansion. The spansion investment is valued at $720m. So where did the remaining $800m go ? Depreciation was $277m, but I have to assume it was offset by capital expense. And where are the Fab36 costs shown ? They are not a separate line item on AMD's balance sheet, even though the spansion asset is shown as a line item.

amd.com 

My guess is that fab 36 will have high base costs, and products from it (if sold at current ASP) will have much lower gross margin than currently achieved from fab 30. But this only an uninformed guess, and I am hoping discussion here can improve it into an educated guess.

That is the question that I was hoping to discuss. I know it is much less interesting than hurling gigahertz and mips, but I think in the end (6 months ?) it will be the determiner of AMD's and Intel's share price.

For my disclosure, I bought intel shares after it dropped to 22, thinking it will fill the gap up to 25 or 26 when the dust clears.

Sarmad

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read | Read Replies (2)

To: dougSF30 who wrote (187709)2/19/2006 10:37:35 AM
From: kvkkc1 of 272560
 
Please don't throw cold water on this discussion, I learned more reading posts from the last 2 days than I knew about either company. It's really good to see both sides presented in a rational manner, with supporting facts.

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read

To: niceguy767 who wrote (187712)2/19/2006 11:11:57 AM
From: Biomaven of 272560
 
If there is such a thing as a slam dunk, AMD's lawsuit is just that from my vantage point. Any settlement in this lawsuit will likely mitigate greatly any Fab 36 costing concerns that any have, assuming, of course, that any such costing concerns are grounds for concern. But in the off chance that a healthy settlement isn't granted by the court

I suggest you start watching the current (excellent) PBS show "Bleak House" to get a more realistic idea of the timing of any definitive decision in the antitrust suit. <g>

Peter

Share Keep | Reply | Mark as Last Read | Read Replies (2)
Previous 10 | Next 10 

Copyright © 1995-2013 Knight Sac Media. All rights reserved.