Coffee Shop | Kosovo


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To: D. Long who wrote (3711)4/15/1999 10:33:00 AM
From: John Lacelle   of 17770
 
d. Long,

Reguarding what happened to the Branch Davidians,
saying that "they brought it upon themselves" is
just the classic old blame the victim strategy.
Thats like saying that the Vietnamese brought the
Viet Nam war upon themselves, or more currently,
the Kosovo refugees that just got bombed by 2
NATO jets. I remember that back in the 1970's,
men (me included) used to blame women for getting
raped. We thought it was because they wore tight
sweaters and wiggled their asses when they walked.

-John

ps Being of Mormon descent, I actually take some
offense to the Branch Davidians being blamed for
what happened to them. They were after all, just
practicing a form of Mormanism...my own ancestors
were "ethnically cleansed" from Illinois...people
were executed, homes were burned. They fled the
United States in fear for their lives. Their fault?

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To: D. Long who wrote (3707)4/15/1999 10:36:00 AM
From: John Lacelle   of 17770
 
D. Long,

I just looked at your profile. As I suspected,
you never studied economics. Otherwise, you
would know that your statement if full of mistakes
regarding the economic status of the United States.

-John

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To: chaosad who wrote (3846)4/15/1999 10:38:00 AM
From: JBL   of 17770
 
Chaosad,

Nuke is a professional soldier, and knowing him from other threads, I can tell you that he is neither an idiot, nor a biggot. War is his job, and you should try to understand and respect his point of view.

I happen to think that the threats Albright made were stupid. They were stupid, because 1. you cannot be a mediator and a potential assaillant at the same time, 2. as is now becoming obvious we could not afford to make those threats, especially given the enormous political, geopolitical, legal, and operational constraints (no ground troops).

That being said, the country has made a choice, and we cannot turn on the military. The politicians are responsible, and they are the one to influence as you see fit . If you feel like vomitting, vomit on them.

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To: Stormweaver who wrote (3553)4/15/1999 11:04:00 AM
From: James F. Hopkins   of 17770
 
James; Right now I don't have the time I wish I had to
explain the full detail of what I see happening, and why I'm convinced
what NATO is doing or at least the way they are doing it is Wrong. .
There are no clean hands in this can of worms, and the truth of
what is going on will not likey come out for years , ( if then ).
I'm good at reading lips, ( I caught Regan looking at
Nancy & calling Nixon a SOB right on national TV; 99% of the viewers missed it even though it was right in front of their eyes )
Remember what is good can often be the enemy of what's the
best.
(1) The KLA is not what it looks like, and if we were on a real
peace keeping mission we would not be taking sides
We would if trying to get them, apart insist that BOTH parties
lay down their weapons.
(2) The KLA now has a Mercenary Army, segregated from the hard core
Mujahedeen that have infiltrated the area for over 3 years now.

The evidence of this can be found even in reports of western news
but you have to have an eye for it.
(3) I'v seen to many Refugee situations over the years to not notice
a lot of this is being fabricated and staged in propaganda effort
by NATO to drum up support, ( there are too many smiling faces and
if one is discerning in looking at the news shots you find too
many people who look like they are on a picnic , busses coming in
from Kosovo ( almost new & in pristine condition ) busses that they never had to start with.
(4) The recent detailed report from the pilot who by accident
shot civilians in the convoy was very revealing.

(a) It did not occur to him that the convoy was doing the same
as a retreating army and burning the stuff they left behind,
however if you follow his description of the fires and patterns
to them it's obvious.
(b) This motorized convoy of refugees was well organized and well supplied, there were no SERBs escorting them at all,
( The Srebs are either pinned down or busy at the border of Albania
were KLA, Mujahedeen , and mercenary Armies are trying to flood
into Kosovo ) the convoy of civilians were as if they were being herded by KLA factions and being told to burn what they left
behind.
(c) the initial spin NATO put on this was monstrous, while the
pilot likely made an error as he for sure jumped to conclusions about
the fires, I can't understand how the persons doing the de briefing
could not see this, there were too many fires and NO Serb troops in that area at all, with the house they had stopped at still intact
and the one they just left freshly started. The Pilot had covered
a very wide area looking for targerts and saw NONE, until he came
on the convoy, and he just conculed that must be SERBS, ( not
very bright ) even the news release was not to bright.
---------------------
If there were any military vehicles ( and that looks doubtful now)
They were KLA units.
-------------------------
Again if we are sincere about building peace, ( we would insist both
sides to stop shooting ) this taking sides sets up a situation that will in the future give the Albainis the excuse to murder Serbs for
years and years to come, and make no mistake the Albanians are not
above it, and indeed have exploited when every they could the opportunities to commit terrorist acts.
-------------------------------
The CIA is wrong ( again ) NATO is also wrong, and We
in the US are making a big mistake, This is even worse than we did
in Viet Nam.
-----------------------
Jim

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To: Monkey Man who wrote (3835)4/15/1999 11:17:00 AM
From: The Philosopher   of 17770
 
In that case, I assume we have very different definitions of "patriot."

After all, in the Revolutionary War, the initial patriots were the Tories who supported their leaders and were proud of their military forces (redcoats). The rebels, however, eventually won and were able to rewrite history to define themselves as patriots.

If your definition of patriotism requires me to look for moral leadership to an adulterer and a perjurer, and to be proud of our ability to bomb farm tractors and schools, you can bet I don't fit your definition of a patriot.

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To: Monkey Man who wrote (3837)4/15/1999 11:18:00 AM
From: The Philosopher   of 17770
 
You really don't get it, do you.

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To: henry8th who wrote (3843)4/15/1999 11:19:00 AM
From: The Philosopher   of 17770
 
How about "war toys for draft-dodging boys"?

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To: The Philosopher who wrote (3859)4/15/1999 11:21:00 AM
From: capitalistbeatnik   of 17770
 
Hey, if ejaculating in someone's mouth isn't sex, then it only makes sense that not supporting the senseless killing of 70 refugees is unpatriotic.

But that really depends on your definition of the word "dead". Watch Clinton try to convince us that without our help they were dead "in spirit" anyway.

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To: Machaon who wrote (3851)4/15/1999 11:23:00 AM
From: capitalistbeatnik   of 17770
 
Genocide is an attempt to remove a race from the face of the Earth. To do this you make a concerted effort to kill the women. This is not happening. This is explusion, not genocide. But then again words don't mean what they mean anymore in the Age of Clinton.

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To: rbarsom who wrote (3850)4/15/1999 11:24:00 AM
From: The Philosopher   of 17770
 
it is not no Americans are being killed. Just
Yugo's who rape and kill children.


Charming.

American lives are valuable. Yugo lives aren't.

Somehow I missed how those Kosovans on the farm wagon were raping and killing children. But I'm sure you'll enlighten me.

Meanwhile, I think you're due for another lithium pill.

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