Pastimes : Zeitgeist Movement and The Venus Project

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From: Kitskid3/9/2010 2:28:10 AM
   of 36
(These notes are from Prometheuspan and not Kitskid).



* 1 My Introduction to TVP;
* 2 A. Tribe
* 3 B. Zeitgeist Films
* 4 C. The Forum
* 5 D. The Threads on the Forum
* 6 E. Ten Nonsensical Arguments Against TVP
* 7 1. The Republican Argument From Ignorance.
* 8 2. The Republican Argument of projected Socialism
* 9 3. The Republican Argument of projected Communism
* 10 4. The Pro Capitalism Argument
* 11 5. The Pro Human Flaw argument, or, the argument from Human Imperfection
* 12 6. The Argument from technological Ignorance
* 13 7. The Argument from Nationalism or Fascism
* 14 8. The Argument from Religion
* 15 9. The Argument from Appeal to Authority
* 16 10. The Argument from Paranoia regarding finances
* 17 F. Serpents in Eden
* 18 The Possible Utopia;
* 19 A. Technologies Hockey Stick Bellcurve
* 20 B. The Truth about Energy
* 21 C. The Truth About Technology
* 22 D. The Truth About Political Science
* 23 E. Maslows Hierarchy of Needs
* 24 F. Ethics and Morality
* 25 The Matrix Has You;
* 26 A. A cage for Your Mind
* 27 B. Religions
* 28 C. 101 Flavors of Rebel Without A clue
* 29 D. The Left VS the Right
* 30 E. Orbital Ideologies
* 31 F. The Matrixes Meme-o-sphere
* 32 G. The Distal and Proximal Stimulus
* 33 H. States of Consciousness
* 34 I. Spectators VS Participants
* 35 J. Propaganda War and The Flesh Puppet Chess
* 36 TVP GateKeepers;
* 37 A. The First Appeal from Authority
* 38 B. Don't peer behind the Curtain
* 39 C. Waiting For Armageddon
* 40 D. Defining A Social Movement
* 41 E. Defining A Cult
* 42 F. Cognitive Dissonance
* 43 G. The Missing Answers
* 44 H. Manifest Dystopia
* 45 I. Bullies With Admin Powers
* 46 J. Sussing out what is REAL
* 47 Trouble In Paradise
* 48 A. How to alienate the Religious
* 49 B. How to alienate Capitalists
* 50 C. How to Alienate Scientists
* 51 D. How To Alienate would- be allies
* 52 E. From Ideological Visionaries to Fascist Control Freaks
* 53 F. Chronic Habitual Use of Ad Hominem Argument
* 54 G. Double Think
* 55 H. Groupthink
* 56 I. Pack Psychology
* 57 J. Egotism
* 58 K. A Video club with delusions of Granduer
* 59 L. A Video Club Cult of Personality in 3 Tiers
* 60 M. The RBEF Split
* 61 N. Carnivals, Circuses, Suckers, Dupes, And Marks
* 62 Conclusions


My Introduction to TVP;

The Venus Project is, according to its own claims, a Social movement for positive radical social change based on the works of one Jaques Fresco and A film maker known as Peter Joseph.

This is their main page.

This is their FAQ.

This Explains the Idea of a Resource Based Economy, also called an R.B.E.

This is apparently their Mission Statement.

This SA exists for the dual purposes of explaining what TVP is, what it claims to be, the difference between the two, and for liberating people caught in the cult.

TVP is NOT a Social Movement, it is in fact a cult.

This is not an easy thing to do for me personally because I rather like the ideals and goals and aims and rhetoric of the Cult. All in all, it is a situation where a very good batch of ideas have still managed to decay into a Cult. In this, my goal has been to help them, to communicate with them, and to try to help them solve their problems. However, a full month into trying to help them and 600 posts or so deep into their forum, they attacked me and banned me because I pointed out that they were breaking their own rules.

In short, TVP is a scam, entirely based on the real very good ideas and real very good concepts that they have, but then consumed into egotism, pack psychology, group think, and double think. For a group whos goals are to create a new semi utopian possible future, they have in fact manifested a dystopian reality on their forums. If they can not manage to bring about real change, real cooperation, real collaboration, or real metaprocess to even an Internet Forum, how then can they have pretensions to be able to solve real world social problems which are orders of magnitude more complicated?

They have no research other than that Conducted by Jaques. Real scientists won't get near them, because their approach is crack-potted. They have no real metaprocess for dealing with conflicts, and their admins are merely abusive trollish Jerks with admin powers.

All energy, time, money, and effort spent trying to help them, or talking on their forum, or giving them money, is thus wasted.

A. Tribe I was first introduced to the movement via a new tribe invitation to a tribe with no references and no threads. Being a good samaritan, I looked up the movement and posted the link. And then I wandered in deeper.

B. Zeitgeist Films

I remembered that I had in fact watched the Zeitgeist films and been mostly apt with agreement and interest. Until recently I had not seen the addendums.

C. The Forum

I began reading the threads in their forum and analyzing their site. It had four main kinds of threads for my purposes. Firstly, Threads which were ignorant attacks or questions against the movement, which there were between 10 and 20 of on the first page of the forums. Secondly People raising legitimate concerns or issues, regarding problems with the movement, of which there were better than 10 in the first pages of the Forum, Thirdly, Interest threads, in which people discussed ideas and interests in the movement (the Vast majority of Threads) And then of course, my threads, where I attempted to provide useful information.

The sheer number of legitimate complaints and issues, and then how they were being handled demonstrated that things were far from paradise. And even the way that the Moderators handled ignorant attackers or merely curious questioners set off every alarm bell I had.

The moderators handled the first kind of threads so badly that I felt sorry for them and jumped in to help them. They answered the second kind of thread so badly that I began to cobble together a basic understanding of the inherent flaws of their approach by simply reading those points which people had made.

"in a world where lip service is the norm, aren't you ready for some real problem solving?"

Yes, I am, but, that is only what they promise and utterly fail to deliver.

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